Discussion:
[Kdenlive-devel] development of a video editing server based on Kdenlive
Volker Grassmuck
2014-09-25 10:37:10 UTC
Permalink
Dear Kdenlive-devels,

we love Kdenlive. A lot. And we want to commission the development of a video editing server based on it that will help alleviate the stunning lack of video in Wikipedia. And the first people who come to mind for asking whether they are interested in the project are those who brought us Kdenlive in the first place: you.

We are the project Videos for Wikipedia Articles (https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/WP:VWA), which was initiated at the Centre for Digital Cultures of Leuphana University Lüneburg, Germany, is supported by Wikimedia Germany and funded by the German Ministry for Education and Science.

Please find below the introduction to the specifications of the service we would like to have developed. We're very curious what you think. We hope you like the idea as much as people at Wikimedia and at the Internet Archive which will provide its infrastructure for development and will host the final service.

And we hope to find one or a group from your midst to commission the work to. Caveat: the VWA project has to close its books by the end of the year. Little time and comparably little money but big chance of establishing Kdenlive as the standard video editor in the Wikipedia universe

I could post the full specs here on the list, maybe as .odt. Or you could contact me offlist <***@vgrass.de> if this request is considered off-topic. Please advise how to proceed.

We find the idea of building a three-way cooperation between the Internet Archive, Wikipdia and Kdenlive really exciting. I hope you share the feeling.

Thank you for Kdenlive!

Best,
Volker


The Video Editing Server
Distributed video production has to struggle with a number of bottlenecks:

• Wikimedia Commons permits uploading of video files only in the patent-free formats WebM / VP8/VP9 and Ogg/Theora.

• Once produced and published on Wikimedia Commons, videos can not be edited further or re-used by other users because those do not have access to either raw footage or project files.

• Distributed volunteer video teams can hardly work together, because the large data volume from common consumer cameras recording in HD and soon 4K make exchanging files difficult.

• Also in editing video, common consumer PCs available to volunteer producers quickly reach their limits due to large data volumes.

• Raw footage can currently only be archived de-centrally by the volunteer producers themselves who continuously have to expand storage capacity or delete material.

• The upload to Wikimedia Commons with regular browsers is limited to 100 MB (1 GB with chunked upload) which is too little for most videos.

A Video Editing Server based on the free, non-linear editing software Kdenlive will solve or alleviate these problems:

• Raw footage will be archived on the Editing Server.

• Producers get smaller proxy clips from the Editing Server that are fast to download and easy to edit on standard consumer PCs.

• After editing, producers upload their video project files to the Server which are then available for other producers.

• From the video project files and the archived raw footage, the Server renders the final video and cross-site uploads it directly to Wikimedia Commons. Thus the producers avoid the computationally intensive rendering as well as the cumbersome process of uploading large files to Wikimedia Commons.
Vincent Pinon
2014-09-29 19:09:11 UTC
Permalink
Hi Volker & List,

Sorry for the late reply...
The idea you are presenting here is indeed exciting!
The choice of Kdenlive for collaborative editing seems well justified, with
proxy editing feature and versionable text file format.
That would promote Kdenlive and KDE software to a much wider audience!

I have limited knowledge about server side needs & solutions.
Maybe Dan or Steve you have know-how to promote?
The help I can provide here would be limited to rendering/transcoding stuff,
project archive layout, quick client adaptations if needed for testing...

On the client side, I think most of the work is to get Win&Mac ports work
again (quite a piece of work), further improve reliability, to answer
expectations of many Wikimedia contributors I guess...
I was planning this on my spare time, so without committing on any timeframe
:-/
This new offer to fund activities on Kdenlive tickles again hesitations to take
a part time for that purpose, but I have to check if it really is feasible
(family life, job constraints etc); end of year is coming so fast...

Once we will be fully part of KDE, we will also be able to mentor SoC
students, maybe one or more subjects could be related to this collaboration?

To discuss more directly, maybe we can arrange a voice or video conference (I
never tried but there should be a way to get it work)?

If there are other volunteers to get involved, please step out ;-)

Best regards,

Vincent.
Post by Volker Grassmuck
Dear Kdenlive-devels,
we love Kdenlive. A lot. And we want to commission the development of a
video editing server based on it that will help alleviate the stunning lack
of video in Wikipedia. And the first people who come to mind for asking
whether they are interested in the project are those who brought us
Kdenlive in the first place: you.
We are the project Videos for Wikipedia Articles
(https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/WP:VWA), which was initiated at the Centre
for Digital Cultures of Leuphana University Lüneburg, Germany, is supported
by Wikimedia Germany and funded by the German Ministry for Education and
Science.
Please find below the introduction to the specifications of the service we
would like to have developed. We're very curious what you think. We hope
you like the idea as much as people at Wikimedia and at the Internet
Archive which will provide its infrastructure for development and will host
the final service.
And we hope to find one or a group from your midst to commission the work
to. Caveat: the VWA project has to close its books by the end of the year.
Little time and comparably little money but big chance of establishing
Kdenlive as the standard video editor in the Wikipedia universe
I could post the full specs here on the list, maybe as .odt. Or you could
off-topic. Please advise how to proceed.
We find the idea of building a three-way cooperation between the Internet
Archive, Wikipdia and Kdenlive really exciting. I hope you share the
feeling.
Thank you for Kdenlive!
Best,
Volker
The Video Editing Server
• Wikimedia Commons permits uploading of video files only in the
patent-free formats WebM / VP8/VP9 and Ogg/Theora.
• Once produced and published on Wikimedia Commons, videos can not be
edited further or re-used by other users because those do not have access
to either raw footage or project files.
• Distributed volunteer video teams can hardly work together, because the
large data volume from common consumer cameras recording in HD and soon 4K
make exchanging files difficult.
• Also in editing video, common consumer PCs available to volunteer
producers quickly reach their limits due to large data volumes.
• Raw footage can currently only be archived de-centrally by the
volunteer
Post by Volker Grassmuck
producers themselves who continuously have to expand storage capacity or
delete material.
• The upload to Wikimedia Commons with regular browsers is limited to 100
MB (1 GB with chunked upload) which is too little for most videos.
A Video Editing Server based on the free, non-linear editing software
• Raw footage will be archived on the Editing Server.
• Producers get smaller proxy clips from the Editing Server that are fast
to download and easy to edit on standard consumer PCs.
• After editing, producers upload their video project files to the Server
which are then available for other producers.

Steve Guilford
2014-10-01 01:00:32 UTC
Permalink
Hello Volker:

Doing something like this gets complicated very quickly. Especially in
a 'public' environment where everybody wants their enhancement/feature
included. There's a lot of disciplines that must be integrated together
as well as workflow and security issues.

That said, Kdenlive's integration requirements may be limited to
precluding one from changing out of the 'root' directory when importing
and rendering content. By doing so, you can build a file based
architecture that restricts the user to a specific directory that only
contains 'their' content.

My suggestion would be to try to build such an environment and then
approach modifying Kdenlive to preclude user-navigation outside of the
root directory.

Steve...>>>
Post by Vincent Pinon
Hi Volker & List,
Sorry for the late reply...
The idea you are presenting here is indeed exciting!
The choice of Kdenlive for collaborative editing seems well justified, with
proxy editing feature and versionable text file format.
That would promote Kdenlive and KDE software to a much wider audience!
I have limited knowledge about server side needs & solutions.
Maybe Dan or Steve you have know-how to promote?
The help I can provide here would be limited to rendering/transcoding stuff,
project archive layout, quick client adaptations if needed for testing...
On the client side, I think most of the work is to get Win&Mac ports work
again (quite a piece of work), further improve reliability, to answer
expectations of many Wikimedia contributors I guess...
I was planning this on my spare time, so without committing on any timeframe
:-/
This new offer to fund activities on Kdenlive tickles again hesitations to take
a part time for that purpose, but I have to check if it really is feasible
(family life, job constraints etc); end of year is coming so fast...
Once we will be fully part of KDE, we will also be able to mentor SoC
students, maybe one or more subjects could be related to this collaboration?
To discuss more directly, maybe we can arrange a voice or video conference (I
never tried but there should be a way to get it work)?
If there are other volunteers to get involved, please step out ;-)
Best regards,
Vincent.
Post by Volker Grassmuck
Dear Kdenlive-devels,
we love Kdenlive. A lot. And we want to commission the development of a
video editing server based on it that will help alleviate the stunning lack
of video in Wikipedia. And the first people who come to mind for asking
whether they are interested in the project are those who brought us
Kdenlive in the first place: you.
We are the project Videos for Wikipedia Articles
(https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/WP:VWA), which was initiated at the Centre
for Digital Cultures of Leuphana University Lüneburg, Germany, is supported
by Wikimedia Germany and funded by the German Ministry for Education and
Science.
Please find below the introduction to the specifications of the service we
would like to have developed. We're very curious what you think. We hope
you like the idea as much as people at Wikimedia and at the Internet
Archive which will provide its infrastructure for development and will host
the final service.
And we hope to find one or a group from your midst to commission the work
to. Caveat: the VWA project has to close its books by the end of the year.
Little time and comparably little money but big chance of establishing
Kdenlive as the standard video editor in the Wikipedia universe
I could post the full specs here on the list, maybe as .odt. Or you could
off-topic. Please advise how to proceed.
We find the idea of building a three-way cooperation between the Internet
Archive, Wikipdia and Kdenlive really exciting. I hope you share the
feeling.
Thank you for Kdenlive!
Best,
Volker
The Video Editing Server
• Wikimedia Commons permits uploading of video files only in the
patent-free formats WebM / VP8/VP9 and Ogg/Theora.
• Once produced and published on Wikimedia Commons, videos can not be
edited further or re-used by other users because those do not have access
to either raw footage or project files.
• Distributed volunteer video teams can hardly work together, because the
large data volume from common consumer cameras recording in HD and soon 4K
make exchanging files difficult.
• Also in editing video, common consumer PCs available to volunteer
producers quickly reach their limits due to large data volumes.
• Raw footage can currently only be archived de-centrally by the
volunteer
Post by Volker Grassmuck
producers themselves who continuously have to expand storage capacity or
delete material.
• The upload to Wikimedia Commons with regular browsers is limited to 100
MB (1 GB with chunked upload) which is too little for most videos.
A Video Editing Server based on the free, non-linear editing software
• Raw footage will be archived on the Editing Server.
• Producers get smaller proxy clips from the Editing Server that are fast
to download and easy to edit on standard consumer PCs.
• After editing, producers upload their video project files to the Server
which are then available for other producers.

Dan Dennedy
2014-10-06 18:14:09 UTC
Permalink
I have been talking to Volker and his team about this in detail. This is a
specific, funded project due by the end of the year. There should be no
Kdenlive changes required. In fact, it is more so based around MLT XML but
particularly Kdenlive's flavor and usage of it. Obviously, I will want
Shotcut to eventually work with this, but I have chosen the route to make
Shotcut more interoperable with Kdenlive within the tool rather than base
the service around it. I must provide my fixed-bid quote for the project
within the next couple of weeks, and I have requested the time off from my
employer for 4 works to work on it if my quote is accepted. If you want to
make your own quote, please contact Volker to get the specifications. Also,
you could choose to work together with me, and we will split the payment.
However, I will want you to be able to commit at least 20 hours per week
during the 4 weeks of heavy lifting. This is actually mainly web
development work using PHP and MySQL (their preferred stack) to manage I/O,
storage, and jobs and to provide some UIs - just to let you know what to
expect. Also, it is mainly a proof-of-concept; so, we are not
unrealistically pursuing something fully polished within such a limited
time frame.
Post by Vincent Pinon
Hi Volker & List,
Sorry for the late reply...
The idea you are presenting here is indeed exciting!
The choice of Kdenlive for collaborative editing seems well justified, with
proxy editing feature and versionable text file format.
That would promote Kdenlive and KDE software to a much wider audience!
I have limited knowledge about server side needs & solutions.
Maybe Dan or Steve you have know-how to promote?
The help I can provide here would be limited to rendering/transcoding stuff,
project archive layout, quick client adaptations if needed for testing...
On the client side, I think most of the work is to get Win&Mac ports work
again (quite a piece of work), further improve reliability, to answer
expectations of many Wikimedia contributors I guess...
I was planning this on my spare time, so without committing on any timeframe
:-/
This new offer to fund activities on Kdenlive tickles again hesitations to take
a part time for that purpose, but I have to check if it really is feasible
(family life, job constraints etc); end of year is coming so fast...
Once we will be fully part of KDE, we will also be able to mentor SoC
students, maybe one or more subjects could be related to this
collaboration?
To discuss more directly, maybe we can arrange a voice or video conference (I
never tried but there should be a way to get it work)?
If there are other volunteers to get involved, please step out ;-)
Best regards,
Vincent.
Post by Volker Grassmuck
Dear Kdenlive-devels,
we love Kdenlive. A lot. And we want to commission the development of a
video editing server based on it that will help alleviate the stunning
lack
Post by Volker Grassmuck
of video in Wikipedia. And the first people who come to mind for asking
whether they are interested in the project are those who brought us
Kdenlive in the first place: you.
We are the project Videos for Wikipedia Articles
(https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/WP:VWA), which was initiated at the
Centre
Post by Volker Grassmuck
for Digital Cultures of Leuphana University LÃŒneburg, Germany, is
supported
Post by Volker Grassmuck
by Wikimedia Germany and funded by the German Ministry for Education and
Science.
Please find below the introduction to the specifications of the service
we
Post by Volker Grassmuck
would like to have developed. We're very curious what you think. We hope
you like the idea as much as people at Wikimedia and at the Internet
Archive which will provide its infrastructure for development and will
host
Post by Volker Grassmuck
the final service.
And we hope to find one or a group from your midst to commission the work
to. Caveat: the VWA project has to close its books by the end of the
year.
Post by Volker Grassmuck
Little time and comparably little money but big chance of establishing
Kdenlive as the standard video editor in the Wikipedia universe
I could post the full specs here on the list, maybe as .odt. Or you could
off-topic. Please advise how to proceed.
We find the idea of building a three-way cooperation between the Internet
Archive, Wikipdia and Kdenlive really exciting. I hope you share the
feeling.
Thank you for Kdenlive!
Best,
Volker
The Video Editing Server
Distributed video production has to struggle with a number of
• Wikimedia Commons permits uploading of video files only in the
patent-free formats WebM / VP8/VP9 and Ogg/Theora.
• Once produced and published on Wikimedia Commons, videos can not
be
Post by Volker Grassmuck
edited further or re-used by other users because those do not have access
to either raw footage or project files.
• Distributed volunteer video teams can hardly work together,
because the
Post by Volker Grassmuck
large data volume from common consumer cameras recording in HD and soon
4K
Post by Volker Grassmuck
make exchanging files difficult.
• Also in editing video, common consumer PCs available to volunteer
producers quickly reach their limits due to large data volumes.
• Raw footage can currently only be archived de-centrally by the
volunteer
Post by Volker Grassmuck
producers themselves who continuously have to expand storage capacity or
delete material.
• The upload to Wikimedia Commons with regular browsers is limited
to 100
Post by Volker Grassmuck
MB (1 GB with chunked upload) which is too little for most videos.
A Video Editing Server based on the free, non-linear editing software
• Raw footage will be archived on the Editing Server.
• Producers get smaller proxy clips from the Editing Server that
are fast
Post by Volker Grassmuck
to download and easy to edit on standard consumer PCs.
• After editing, producers upload their video project files to the
Server
Post by Volker Grassmuck
which are then available for other producers.
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